Petri Nieminen on Music, Evolution, and the Origins of Proper Man

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Welcome to Heat Cast, the official podcast of He Changed

It. As always, I am Mike Chisholm as

always. I am so excited to be here and

to talk about the world of men's mental Wellness in all of the

facets and pathways that we explore in that topic.

Obviously, we are the official podcast of He Changed It.

If you haven't downloaded the He Changed It app, what are you

Waiting for? It has never looked better.

Things are happening behind the scenes.

It's, I know I'm a broken record when it comes to that, but it's

just really exciting to watch this thing grow.

And at the end of the day, you know he changed.

It is the first men's mental Wellness platform that has been

created and we're incredibly proud of of what's been

happening and what is going to happen now.

We have been in partnership for some special episodes of he cast

with a company called Telus for the Canadians.

You know what Telus is for other people around the world, you

might not necessarily know who they are.

Telus is a massive, massive communications company in

Canada. Cell phone provider, broadcast

television provider, massive Internet provider.

And we went into and did a very cool program with Telus and in

it the result was 5 amazing episodes of he cast, which we

are now going to put out on our platform here.

The episodes are with a band, The band is called Proper Man

and a proper man is a local band from Kelowna, BC and all five

members have a story. The entire band has a story.

And so as a narrative, all five episodes tie in together kind of

like Voltron, you know a whole bunch of robots coming together

to make one super robot, kind of like that.

Each episode is amazing and I'm so proud of the work that we

have done. I'm so proud to be friends with

these guys and it's a pretty special story.

So without further ado he cast the official podcast of He

Changed It would like to present a proper man the he cast

conversations Welcome to he cast the official podcast of He

Changed It. My name is Mike Chisholm and we

are watching the five part special proper man.

The he cast conversations that we shot in conjunction with

Telus Story Hive earlier this year.

We're releasing them on our platform.

Now we get to the guitar player who doesn't love a good guitar

player. Wow gosh Petrie is is certainly

that and more. I love Petrie.

He and Jason is Co founders of proper Man I believe are a yin

and Yang to each other in many respects they are extremely

complimentive to each other and and and I just I Petrie is he's

analytical and and and and really thoughtful and technical

and I just really appreciate him very much opening up talking

about his vantage point his you know in in many respects Proper

Man exists because of him and I I can't wait to get his story

out there and and and and once again very grateful for all

these guys being as vulnerable as they are.

There are going to be people who watch these episodes that get

helped because they can relate and relation is with these

things. Is is is kind of a silver bullet

knowing you're not alone and there's a lot of guys going

through stuff right now. Hearing these five guys open up

about things that they have been through things that have helped

will help other people and that is that is a a driving force

behind why these guys said yes to this project Proper man is

incredible. Go check them out as a band.

Please enjoy Petrie on the He Cast conversations with proper

Man. Petrie to me and to proper well,

I I started playing hockey with Petrie when I was 10 years old.

The joke I stay on stage is he's a just a he's a really good

person, but he had a really shitty shot.

It's like the wounded duck, you know, those hockey players know

what I'm talking about? No.

I've known Petrie a very long time, very smart individual,

very even keel. I've have issues with sometimes

anxiety and stress and all that great stuff.

He's very calm and cool even though he feels it too.

So he's always been a very good person in my life to help

balance me out. Incredibly good songwriter he's

he throws like like I say all these proper man songs.

Most of them he threw the cords down for.

I'd go over top of it and the band would come in later and and

make it what it is. Without the band, there's

nothing. It's just a process.

But Petrie, you know, because it was his job in the beginning to

do this thing. Seven years later, he's putting

a suit on every Saturday and getting on stage and and he

always says it before we go on. So he's a really interesting

guy. He looks at us and goes, we're

good looking guys. He has it and he's dead serious.

It's a definitely a midlife crisis thing.

Like, you know, some dudes, they get in the car and they're like

they're they're the shit. We sit in that little alleyway

before we play and it's like we think we're playing Madison

Square Garden. Everyone's hugging and high

fiving and every time Petrie's like we're we're really good

looking guys and I don't know why he says that, but that's

Petrie. We're here with Petrie.

Finally. Hello.

Yes, hello. When Jason talks about you, he

talks about Finnish heritage. Yes, that's a Tekken.

And he says hey, he knows that's a Tekken.

And that's the first thing he says.

That all the time on stage about you.

Like like born in Finland. Born in Sweden.

In Sweden, yeah. And so my parents, Finnish, My

dad and mom happened to be living in Sweden at the time.

My dad was a a contract welder so he was working at a a special

project and so I was born there and so that's, if you know

anything about Finland, Swedish kind of dynamics, mostly the

hockey. I'm the black sheep because you

know I love to bust the Swedes chops.

Makes sense and. You know so and vice versa so,

but it's it's a friendly kind of.

So yeah, Born in Sweden and my parents emigrated to Canada.

I grew up in Kitimats, same as Jason.

Yeah, How old were you when you moved to Kitimat?

Oh, that's so. That was in 74, so I would have

been a year and a half. And my mom was pregnant with my

brother seven months, 8. Like I can't believe they let

her on the plane. But I think back then there's

probably a little more loosey goosey on Intercontinental

rules. And yeah, but I but I I think

they told me the story and I don't know if it's if it's true

but you know the only reason they were able to get on the

plane was because there was a doctor on board.

So wow. Intercontinental have to ask my

mom if that really is a truth. Yeah.

No kidding. So.

I'm moving the whole family over with.

Yeah, so. The baby and the baby on the

way. Baby on the way and moved into

Kitimat, BC in February 74 and the snow up there, if I think

most BC people you know who have been up there or they they know

the the area, it's just incredible the amount of snow

they they get there and they didn't see the mountains or sky

for what my mom you know told me for days and they were just what

did we, what did we do here? Where do we live And then I

think they you know the one day when it finally there was a

break in the weather they looked and it's just it's just

beautiful country up there and the mountains it's basically

nestled in a valley and the mountains are just imposing so

but. The very definition of God's

country. Yes, yes, that, that it, that

would, when the weather's nice, it is God's country and yeah.

And growing up playing hockey right away, did you and Jason

meet playing hockey? Yeah, we met.

So he was always kind of a year ahead of me in hockey.

So just the age difference, that's just how the minor hockey

system works, of course. So I would kind of see him every

second year and it wouldn't have been until after.

About Adam, Well, it's all different nowadays with how they

name the divisions and stuff. For minor hockey, that would

have been Adam. Yep.

And into Pee Wee when I started playing Rep hockey.

So you know, we we were a AA kind of rated town, you know?

You're wearing the Letterman jackets.

You're. Yeah, you're the.

And so, yeah, the big dogs. The big dogs.

And so I guess I could have played rapping, Adam, but my

parents didn't let me, you know, They weren't too sure about

that. And I think one of the coaches

convinced my my mom and dad that, you know, hey, you should,

you should let them play Rep hockey.

And so I'm glad they did. So I probably would have never

really met Jason then, so. So was music part of your life

already? Not I think it was I I love to

listen to music. Even from a young, from a young

age I didn't. And I think I got my first

guitar like AI think. My parents knew that I was

musical. I mean, I think my uncle, I have

an uncle, a couple uncles that are very musically inclined, and

I I I would listen to music just relentlessly like, I mean, what?

Kind of stuff. Would you listen to?

Oh man, it it varied, honestly. Like, I'm sure I was influenced

by what my parents were listening on the record player.

I mean, they were listening to a lot of Finnish folk music, of

course, but you know, they were listening to classics, you know,

You know, Angle, Engelbert, Humperdinck, Anonymous, Curry,

Beatles, you know, all that kind of stuff that wasn't finished.

But you know that old people, I guess, listen to.

There's always music. In the house, though, but.

Yeah, there was, there was, there was music in the house.

And yeah, so I mean that. I think just when I got my first

acoustic guitar, you know, nothing fancy.

And I I just started playing it and then went into to band you

know six and seven and and yeah and and so always wanted to play

guitar so I played trumpet and then come to grade 8.

I didn't want to do band anymore because the band teacher

wouldn't let me play guitar. And to this day, I I regret it

that I that I quit band high school band, you know Grade 8.

Because I think it I could have not.

Not, not that I'm not happy with where I'm at right now as a

musician, but I think it would have given me more tools earlier

on more. Theory More structure when your

brain is still learning. Absolutely, absolutely.

Reading sheet music better. But yeah, from a young age, I

think I would say really, you know, when I was 10/11/12 is

when I really started to get very interested in music.

Cool. My first record was Mötley Crüe

shot at the Devil. I remember, and my parents

weren't happy. They hit that thing when they

kind of, you know, because they're, you know, they're

English as a second language. Sure, But I mean, you look at

the cover and it's just 4/4 dudes that are just satanic and.

The word devil on it shot at the.

Devil. And you know, my dad's just

like, what is this garbage, you know?

And so they try and hide it on me and you know, I would find

it. Sorry, Mom.

You know, I knew where they tucked it.

And so I'd secretly listened to it and anything.

That was pleasing to your ears. You went for it.

You didn't put up boundaries when I came to that exactly.

Which makes a lot of sense, actually, watching proper man

play. I mean, you can tell that the

whole band doesn't seem to have any boundaries as to the the

influences are literally across the entire spectrum, yeah.

Yeah I would agree really we're blast like I mean Jason and I

always joke I mean we're I mean Jason's very competent on the

drums but you know we always joke you know we're kind of the

the the weak link you know as far as musicians and because

we're I mean Travis is a monster on keys.

Justin of course on the drums is is is a machine and Nori his

bass playing and his his vocals and and he's been around the

block you know he's playing a lot and so so we're we're very

fortunate to have these guys around us and and so we always

joke that you know we we kind of get away with it but I mean not

you know of course you know with the songwriting you know Jason

taught me a lot and you know and just from listening to my

influences it really I've been happy how I've grown as a

songwriter really like because that was not my that was not my

skill set until you know I mean I did a little bit of it you

know in the early days playing with Jason you know with with

punk bands and stuff but it wasn't until you know really

starting to work with him here. You know getting back into it.

It's just where I I just kind of learned, you know, not only

learn from him, but I I I just learned to trust myself to you

know and and trust how I, you know.

Be confident. Did you?

Have the imposter syndrome as a musician, did you?

I. Always do.

I still do. Really.

I think that's a natural thing for for anyone.

Really. Yeah.

I sometimes I have it at work. I have it up here on on stage.

And, you know, you're your own worst critic, of course.

And. Yeah.

And I think some, some people, some men are probably more, you

know, sensitive to that and which can be a, which can be an

issue, right. Well, I'm glad you brought that

up. I want to talk about like the

formation of Proper Man everybody when we say OK, well

you know, where did Proper Man come from?

And really at the end of the day it comes down to you.

They talk about how this band was started.

And I just, I love, I love everything about the idea of

friends being there for friends and especially in this world of

guys being there for guys. And and how there are a lot of

these things that maybe would be done over the years, you know,

as the stigma was around quietly but never really talked about,

really. At the end of the day, proper

man had a lot to do with with helping you.

Well, I mean that that sounds egotistical, but I know where

you it's not. I think I know where you're

going with this. But yeah I know.

I mean Jason, really the the before it was even proper, man.

Really it was, it was, you know, I was going through a tough time

and and you know making a move, just going through a separation

and you know going into you know, split family situation and

moving to the Okanogan. And really I was able to kind of

find a kind of find a place to kind of start you know start

over so to speak. And it was nice that, you know,

I was able to reconnect with Jason because we hadn't.

I mean, we kept in touch, of course, you know, he's been my

close friend for many, many years.

He were from. Northern BC down to to yeah.

When we when I mean adventures. Well.

We did, yeah. We did a few ventures there from

Kitimat, you know, and into Vancouver and stuff.

So. So it was kind of a a reset, so

to speak. So really it was we had no

intention of playing music. I had.

No, I I didn't. It just didn't even occur to me.

And then I think I and I don't truthfully, I don't even

remember why we decided to just sit down.

And I think it was probably a couple too many whiskeys.

And then and then really it was just, you know let's let's have

a little little jam just for old times sake.

And then and then really like right away it's I think there

was something there the first time we kind of sat down.

OK yeah, yeah, I remember. And then you know I had some I

had a laptop with you know Garage band on it that's which

is a recording software, right. So and so he he also had a, he

had a you know it was a neat little unit like it's not like a

Roland unit that you know that you can record on.

It's a little board and you can record on it mix and and do all

sorts of things and and so he so he had left this.

I don't know if he manipulated it and left left the unit, you

know, in the basement a bread crumb.

Yeah. You know, and actually I I don't

even know if that's the real story, but I'll stick with it

anyway. So we had the, the recording

unit in the in the rental house at the winery house in Peachland

there. It was a beautiful property.

So he was kind enough to he was doing his winery operations on

that property. So the house was vacant so I

stepped in and rented it and and so yeah, so with the split

family situation I'd have the my two daughters with me every

every other week. So, so the recording unit was

down there. And so I had just one night just

thought, OK, I'll muck around and I sent him something that I

was quite proud of. And he, yeah, Jason's funny

because, you know, when he doesn't like something, I know

when he doesn't like something. Yeah, yeah, that was, you know,

that was like good try, you know, he was very encouraging.

In the in the sweetheart. But he knows.

He knows how to burst your bubble in a kind of a kind way.

Yeah. And so so kept working working

on it and he'd you know humor me and put you know he'd do vocals

on it and add some keys and stuff like that and he's very

creative with that kind of stuff to and we hadn't even to that

point we didn't really know what we were doing or what direction

or and I think he just got I think he just had enough of me

sending him garbage so he and and and I when I say garbage

it's like it's just not connecting with.

Either of us, I mean. I was proud of some of the

stuff. And so it was a we, you know And

then I think he decided you know one night let's let's just get

the recording and you and I will sit.

And back in the day in in Glasshead there was the old punk

band in Kitimat where where we kind of did quite well with that

little pop punk band. I mean we you know once CBC

Galaxy award, Rising Star award and you know we toured, we went

to Japan, got paid to go to Japan to tour and so that's a

lot. Of adventures for an indie band

it is. Yeah, I mean, we were big in

Japan. You know, that's only in a few

cities. But But yeah, I mean, not talk

about an opportunity that you couldn't refuse, right?

Yeah, it was. It was something else.

And now I've kind of lost where I was going with this story.

So no, no. No, no, it's it's, it's good

because I want to, I want to go back to something that you said

before we, you know, before we continue on.

Because, I mean, obviously things did gel and it's grown

into a direction where the two of you in that basement could

probably never have even fathomed this being where you're

at right now. And and, yeah, so that's thanks

for jogging my memory there. So yeah, so basically we when we

would kind of write with Glasshead, we'd sit down with

you know Bacardi, Lyman and Coke.

Yep. That was, I don't know what it

was little bit inspiration. I think it was probably because

it was cheaper and it had a decent taste.

You know he didn't have we were lazy at the time until until he

became and you know you know him and I became cocktail kind of

gurus. Snorri likes to thinks he's

pretty good with making cocktails.

He's getting better. He's getting better.

Oh, OK. Well, that's good.

We'll tell him that. We'll let him know.

You keep going. Buddy, Yeah.

And so he his idea was you know what let's just for all time

sake of course a couple of Bacardi Bacardi lineman's and

and coke and and have a couple of puffs of something else you

know and and and yeah and and all I we just started kind of

rocking out doing our thing and he on.

Drums. You own guitar at the time, or

was it really? It was weird I I think at that

time because that machine kind of had a a a drum machine on it.

So it was more, you know, we'd like pass the guitar to one

another because, I mean he played guitar and sang with

Glasshead, right? So he so we were kind of doing

that and I think we did have the electronic drum kit down there

for that night for sure. And then we just something

happened and we started writing and playing this song and it

sound and I think I can't remember if it was Jason I was

like it sounds like a song that a German kid in you know leader

lederhosen would be like dancing to and and and we just couldn't

stop laughing and I think but with that kind of not mistake

but yeah no no with that direction what came out of us

that night it it just kind of you know what it drove to that

European sound and there and and it was you know a slurring kind

of British accent you know kind of what he was trying to put

over that and it just something Oh my God that's this is this is

what this is what we need to do and then we it brought.

Joy. It obviously brought joy.

There and it and it it brought it brought out you know kind of

our our influences too you know with with new waves so and

Depeche. Mode or some of these other

yeah, yeah. You know, the cure big in, you

know and after the kind of the metal had kind of phase like I

was talking about what I was listening to.

Yeah, I mean anything that was good.

So that included New Wave, you know, secretly because it was a

weird thing back then, you know, and I I think it is to this

today for kids, you know, teenagers.

Like you want a certain thing to be your own, you know?

And when it gets popular, you got to not like it right.

Even if it's and that. Was New Wave for me.

It was so popular. Yep, it was on the radio.

I loved, I loved a lot of and a lot of the music that was out

there for New Wave and I loved a lot of the artists and it was A

and it's been a huge influence for me.

You know guitar players. You know from, you know, Flock?

Flock of Seagulls, Yeah, like Morrissey.

Are you a Morrissey guy? I I respect.

I I didn't. Yeah.

Yeah, totally. I mean I but that.

John, all the those those, yeah. I mean all that stuff, you know

The Smiths. Yeah, you know Tears For Fears.

You know what? What I what I learned later you

know as I tried to progress as a better musician than a guitar

player of how underrated some of these you know, new wave guitar

players musicians were because of how they completed a song not

you know back. You know not saying metal bands

were not great bands. I mean they were individual

players. It's a different.

It's a different. It's a process.

Different everything, yeah, but. New wave, new wave and that kind

of thing. What attracted me to it was I

think it went back to the basics of layering and melody and

sounds and how it completed a band and it was a team effort

and that kind of that's why I kind of it's kind of stuck

around as an influence to me, like the police and and all

these Bowie. I love Bowie, yeah.

Yeah. But you weren't really supposed

to really like him. Yeah.

No. I know what you're talking

about. Yes, absolutely.

I I almost like a lot of secret material.

Yeah. Yeah.

And it's just he was incredible going to see.

Aerosmith but I'm listening to Bowie.

Yeah. And but yeah, the big, big

influence and you too, I mean massive influence for me, you

know the edge of the way he he was, he was the epitome of

layering and just innovation of of what he did for sounds and Oh

yeah, and he's, you know, he's a competent guitar but you know 10

times the guitar player I am and you know and how he

revolutionized. Oh.

Yeah, his guitar sounds. And how many?

And to this day, I'm still, it's like, God damn it, it sounds

exactly like the Edge, but so how can I make it, you know,

sound like my own? So it's incredible.

What? Yeah, I just thought they were

incredibly underrated artists. Maybe at, you know, looking back

at the time, I was like. I want to go back to these these

basement sessions in proper man what what would become proper

man. You talk about some of the

things that you were going through now.

I mean I know you know off camera we've even talked about

how much you love your family families everything that's you

know and and but at the same time you know there's a lot of

guys who who who watch and listen to this stuff who have

gone through their own version of when a a family splits up in

that kind of thing and and and there's there's there's kind of

two or three things that we go through we go through the the

mechanics of what needs to happen next adjusting to change

sometimes many many times. Then there's the family aspect

of of what's the dynamic going to look like.

How is everybody is it combative is it how emotional is it and

all that. And then many times lastly is

well how am I doing what am I going through.

One of the things that, you know, Jason has talked about and

whatnot is that that, you know, friendship is really, really

important. And starting a band when guys

are going through things that are really, really tough, you

know, is one of those things that that can sometimes help get

people through things for both, for everybody, you know, because

it feels good to help, but it also is necessary to be helped.

That kind of a thing. As you were going through what

you were going through. What are some of the things that

on the third category, the things that you were dealing

with at the time when you went through this stuff?

Yeah. I think, you know, you

automatically kind of the first things you think about is Oh

well, you know, how is this going to affect the kids.

You know if there's guilt, you know, there's, you know what

could I have done different, you know, to to to not go into this

situation And you know, so I mean it's it's almost like a

grieving process. I mean like you you hit it

perfectly. I mean, there's different kind

of phases and yeah, you you, you really need to rely on the

people that you know that you care about.

You know and and and not. Be afraid to to rely on people

like that and so easier. Said than done.

It is. It really is like, was that?

Hard for you to even reach out? Or did you internalize a lot of

this stuff? Or did you reach out?

I mean, did you know that automatically that you needed

somebody to to to reach out to to help 0?

Yeah, I mean like you know the first first people really

obviously, you know would would be like my mom and you know

stuff like that. So but it but of course there's

that, you know, even having, you know, getting the nerve to tell

hesitation. There's hesitation there.

My God, I've. I've you know she's going to be

disappointed you know and you know and but you know she was

very supportive you know and the fear.

Usually is worse than the absolutely.

It is, yeah. And then, you know, then

reaching out to friends to tell you know.

And then how do you bring this news out so that it's, you know,

not found out on Facebook, you know, like something awkward

like that. So yeah.

So it it it's hard. But it you have to do it like

it. I mean I I just looked at it

more. Yeah.

I I just this is something I need to do and I I need to deal

with it And yeah like growing up, you know in my kind of

family situation but with my father and my mother you know

very, very traditional you know stay at home mom and you know

dad works nine to five you know supper's on the table and so

it's and and great values were given to my brother and I.

But it's also, you know, it's there's things like, you know,

stiff upper lip, you know, like, you know, yeah be, you know,

just man. Up man up.

Just deal with it. Deal.

You know you've gotta you've gotta deal with it and and so I

think I think I think the concept is is yeah I know what

what they're saying but I I don't think there was that you

know the the knowledge of how important really it is to kind

of reach out and ask for help when you when you need help

because you know man up could mean so many different ways you

know things right and and manning up in my my opinion

would be yeah not not afraid to be vulnerable not afraid to ask

for help and just you know yeah and and be that supportive

person to somebody who who needs that help too and and know when

to ask for help and yeah it's it's it's a difficult thing and

it's as with. I don't, we haven't talked about

this aspect of he changed it yet.

But that's something that we've talked about.

I mean, gosh about fourth or fifth episode that we've put

out, he changed it. We want, we want to change the

world. That's, that's what the team

wants to do and wants to make men's mental Wellness something

that can be easily, easily brought out into the light with

no stigma and nothing attached to.

One of the things that that that that we as a as a group want to

do is take back the phrase man up and and literally make it the

definition that you just talked about.

That manning up is here's what I'm going through and here's

what we're going to do about it. And and and and and and and

having it to be a phrase that includes vulnerability right

from the gecko, not, not, not the sniffer lip part, the

traditional definition of or stigmatized version of what man

up might be. And it's just so cool to hear

you just even organically say that.

Clearly that is something that has come to you from learning.

Absolutely, Yeah. Did you ask Jason for help, or

did he see that his friend needed help?

You know, we're both kind of the same.

We don't literally, we could sit in his basement bar and not say

a single friggin thing to one another and just be content, you

know? I mean we just but I think I

think we just we just both knew because I I he went through a

similar thing many many years ago And so he understood he he

he understood how hard it is and and how you need to lean on

people and he he did lean on people and and and I'm glad he

did because it just gets you through the process.

I don't want to say easier but I mean it just makes it yeah it's

it's a process right. So it's not and it's never going

to be a perfect process but he just knew and and I and I think

music was kind of our our out and then really and then as the

band started to you know to to develop like really like you

said, everyone's got their situation whether you know with

family life or friends. And we're all, I mean, we're all

blessed and fortunate to to be, you know be able to do this in

a, in a place like this. Yeah.

Have our own jam spot. Really.

Yeah. Make music as a hobby and as a

passion and you know, live out our midlife crisis like this.

You know, I mean Justin's the young guy but you know he's

still got a partner. He's still got a family.

Absolutely. So everyone's I think the way we

approach this band is is why it's been successful is because

we do rely and lean on one another and each other's

families and and we've made it you know kind of AI mean got my

my girlfriend wife partner whatever you want to call it.

You know she I consider my wife yeah.

But you know she you know we've got our wives pictures on the

wall here and you know and how we've how we've built this band

is on really family and friends and and making it accessible to

to to to myself and my partner Angela and you know to our kids

and you know I think that's why it's been successful because

yeah I think I said it before it's it's just been a it's been

a it's a family oriented. I I I love that, you know?

And yes. Well, and and I mean, the cool

thing about this is when you guys talk, you guys are a

family. You guys are a brotherhood.

Yep. But then that brotherhood, your

families come first more than anything.

And you guys are intrinsically there for each other.

If one of you, like we talk about Nori and what he went

through with with his wife and and and and and and and how you

guys were there for him when that was happening and how you

and it's it's it's it's almost ironic in a sense that, you

know, Jason goes through something in his life, sees you

going through something in your life, oh, hey, let's bring music

to it. Music can be an outlet for us.

It can be a a, a gateway to us expressing our friendship, our

our past with each other, that kind of a thing.

Clearly though, as proper man develops completely different

than the previous band because of these things that you have

learned along the way and taken these lessons and literally

instilled them into the thing that you use as this outlet, as

this creative outlet, as this. I mean you know you you have a

job that I think is is extremely important and it's one that that

that that that helps serve the greater community work for the,

you know, environment. But at the end of the day, if

that is not your passion. If that's not the thing that.

Brings you all that joy. You need to find other things in

your life and I don't want to put words in your mouth.

I think every guy out there who's working somewhere that

doesn't necessarily fill their cup needs to find something that

fills your cup and and that's what proper man seems to Again,

I you know this thing, it writes itself.

The band is titled Proper Man, you know, and it seems like what

you guys are doing is to help keep you be proper men.

Yeah absolutely And and it that that's exactly it and I think

that's the the title proper man really is like you know how can

we be or help others be the best man that you can be.

I mean and it and it sounds like a cheesy slogan and and but

really that's that's kind of the influences, you know.

Yeah. Like, do you remember?

Where the name came from? I haven't asked that question

yet. Truthfully, I I I'm sure Jason

somehow made it up. Goodness, I wish.

I I wish. I remember that one.

I'm sorry but. No, don't be, don't be.

Because I'm sure there's a A really, really good story behind

that. Yeah, there's there has to be.

But no, really, it was. It's not just.

The name of a band, it is a It's an attitude.

And and and really the I it it really, I think the genesis of

it really is from that portrayal of being a gentleman, you know,

having, you know, dressing smartly, you know, just being,

you know, being nice to women, you know, being being nice to

your kid, being a family man. You know, that's that's being

good to the community. You know, bringing back to the

community. I think that's really, I think

where you know proper man, you know that's where that name

really I think. Yeah, came from.

It's an attitude. It really is.

And when you see you on stage like like and and make no

mistake, you guys rock. But you do it kindly like, I

mean, yeah, we try. To I mean, we we do, we do slip

up on the swear words at once. Oh no, no.

No, I don't think that's. I think you can.

I think you can still swear. Kindly, no, I know and I'm

joking, But yeah, really it nothing, you know, makes us

happier than seeing, you know, people really enjoying it.

And and I think what the band has done, what I've heard the

feedback is it takes people back to you know it takes you know

men back or you know and it it takes you know to to takes you

back to a spot you know where nostalgia.

I'm sure Jason's going to word that Jason's going to use that

word. I'm certain he will.

And that's what you know it's that's what it's all that's what

it's all about, having a good time and.

I want to talk about the character.

You know that that that some people in the band, they look at

their role as a as a total character, you know and you

know, Nori being Slim, Pickens, you know, Justin being killer.

What's your character? 29 And really it's it's a silly

story. It really is.

We were actually doing, we were getting fitted for suits and you

know we're in the in the. We as being the band.

The band, yeah. So we were getting fitted for

proper suits, you know, and and so it came to my turn and I

said, yeah, well, my pant size is 29, so, so that's, I'm sorry,

I wish it was no, you know, more interesting or funnier than than

that, no, but. I want to know the difference

between 29 and and and Petri like what's what's the

difference? Honestly.

Honestly, 29 I I really don't have.

I can't really distinguish Petrie from 29 except 29 is up

on stage here. I I still try, 29 still tries to

be Petrie and Petrie tries to be 29.

We we still, I still I get to potentially throw up my back

every once in a while while I'm up here like you know but and

and really I throw out my hips and my and my my ankles and

stuff running with with Angela you know my wife.

And so I honestly, I I I I don't have.

You see them being the same, your authentic self.

He's the guy that's up here playing.

I just, I dress really nice up here and I I try and dress up

nice when I'm out, you know, being Petri.

But oddly enough sometimes and it it's it, it can vary.

I sometimes I feel more comfortable being Petri out

there. Sometimes I feel more

comfortable being 29 up here. Oh isn't that interesting?

I don't know. Yeah.

There's no, there is no credible story to say that 29 and Petri

is different. This is.

The credible story the the credible story that you come up

here and and and the idea that and I mean the journey that

you've been on, the things that you've gone through.

Yeah I mean it's it's it seems to me that authenticity is

extremely important to you and and everything that you do

including the the releases, the the releases that you do, music

being you know kind of a chief one for you obviously.

Yeah, you're you're you're the same guy and that seems to be

that's something that you've you've learned.

I don't want to put words in your mouth but that's what

that's the impression I'm getting.

Yeah, I. Try and I try like to this day

you know like lessons learned from you know from where I was

when I moved here to where I am now and I'm you know in a better

place and and and happy and and and always working on myself you

know I'm I'm how do you work with yourself.

Well I mean this band with my wife she she challenges me she's

a great woman. I I I think exercise is

important for for not only physical but mental health and

to be able to balance things and and keep keep your body and your

mind in a good place or it or it helps you.

I think there's a foundation there you know physical activity

makes you feel better about yourself.

I I feel and I'm not trying to pitch a no a lifestyle here.

No, no, no no. I think one thing I've learned

is that's helped me as a stress relief.

It's helped me to be able to do this.

It's helped me, you know, you know, because it when I'm

getting into this age, I'm I'm feeling my it's only natural to

start feeling about you know talk thinking about your

mortality. And you know my father passed

away at an early age of 56. You know I'm.

I'm 50 now. So yeah, I'm I'm cognizant of

you know what, not a fear. But I'm.

I mean, that's no. But cognizant, I think is

cognizant. You're aware I want to.

I don't, I don't want to be gone yet.

You know at 56 I I I feel like I have a lot more to do and

explore and and just, yeah. So yeah.

I appreciate that you're you're able to kind of share some of

these lessons. Clearly you know again it's a

it's a it's a theme. You know Jason went through

lessons, saw you, you, you, your friendship brought you through

lessons, brought you to the place that you all are now

you're all taking these lessons and and using them and

expressing them and it's such a such a positive way.

What are some of the songs that you guys have written that you

that are close to your heart that you're really proud of?

Oh, my goodness. I mean, there's there's so many,

Mike. I mean, we we've, we've.

I literally have hundreds of songs that you know, are, you

know, archived on my on my MacBook and you know, and he's

probably got hundreds on his Roland Tascam, that unit that

you know, and we still use that to this day.

You know, I'll send him something.

Honestly, I'm really honestly, I think I'm probably proud.

You know, it's not necessarily my favorite song, but I'm, I'm

proud of Pub night. That's the, that's one of the

first, it's one of the first songs that we as a, you know,

that we came up with and it's the one that's still in our

arsenal, so to speak. And it's kind of stood the test

of time for us. And yeah, there.

I mean, there's so many. Good video for that song, right?

Yeah. Yeah, you know, in Nori's house.

That was that, that was that pub.

Night. Yeah, that was pub night.

No, that was that. That one had various clips.

Oh, OK, OK. I thought there was one shot at.

Nori's house. That was a big that was a drink.

Oh, that was a drink. Yes, yeah, that was a fun time.

That's a great song. We filmed that at Nori's and so

that that's yeah, that's that's a special one too because it

actually that was our kind of our second jam space was in in

Slim's Slim and Kristen's basement there.

So he kind of built a bar and a so we thought we'd have this

alternate between Jason's old bar stage area and slim space.

Well, there's. A theme.

The idea you know, pub night, I drink.

Broken Hearts Club, you know. Booze and bars.

And getting together and friendship, though.

And and and and that's really camaraderie, yeah.

It really is which? Is what you guys are all about.

Tell me about Bloodless. Bloodless is, you know what

Bloodless is? I love.

I love that song. Yeah.

And and I love playing it. And I'm going to tell you a

couple of reasons why. Because I didn't write a single

lick in that song. You're kidding.

No. And I love it because you know

it. It's it's not.

It's. I like playing a cover song, but

it's but it's being for me to be able to play it when somebody

else has written the parts has been a treat because and and how

that song grew and I wasn't. I didn't have to do a single

recording session. I'm lazy.

Yeah, it's kind of fun. How about you're?

Busy. Yeah, No, because you are that

too. And literally like Travis had

written that song with Jason and the guitar parts.

What you hear on on that track when we do release it it's it's

all Travis's tracks and when I when he sent me the song hey man

do you mind doing your parts for this And I I told him Javis

nothing needs to be done like you've captured you've captured

what's needed in this song. So I love that song and we've

already played it live a couple Times Now and I I enjoy it and

it's a different direction right.

It it really is a different type of song for proper man because

it is it's it's an anthem I I the definition like an anthem

being big being you know explosive and powerful that's

how I would describe it. Whereas our other material that

you know Jason and I have written have been more on the

kind of new WAVY kind of the the I guess the what do you call the

bread and butter proper man stuff sure.

And and same with you know, the other new song is a little bit

more edgier, right. So, but Bloodless is a great

song and I think it captures, it captures some interesting stuff

for the band but but also for for for Jason, for Norm, because

there's some hard work there for him and he put his, he put his

heart out on some of that on those vocal lines and and the

way he's projecting, projecting it out.

So I was proud of him. I would.

Submit physically and mentally. He's putting a lot of stuff.

Oh my. Goodness, yeah, it's like it's.

It's. It's almost funny.

It's not funny to watch him on stage, but you you, you can tell

it. It takes a lot out of him and

it's a difficult, difficult song to open a set with.

And that's what we've we've decided to do.

Yeah, well. In the writing, kudos to.

Him. Yeah, absolutely.

The writing of it too, I mean that it's to get.

I think to get something like that.

It takes a lot to get something like that.

Oh. Absolutely.

And I think you'll learn from Travis probably Travis and Jason

more of what went into that and what you know.

But it just goes to show and prove that this band, this

brotherhood, like nobody anyone's allowed to bring

something to the table, you know, and and we all respect one

another enough as as human beings and as as musicians that

we we just trust in the process and we trust in ourselves.

So it's pretty cool. I'm going to, I'm going to ask

one last question. I assume the the family split

toughest thing you've ever gone through.

It up. There it it's up.

Oh yeah, absolutely. You know, the death of my

father, you know, death of, you know, of course it's, it's up

there. It's a life changing.

It's a life changing event, yeah.

You know, if you you said this yourself, one of the first

things that happens when you go through something or something

that's happening is you start second guessing.

What could I have done differently, That sort of thing.

You've got a lot of time now where there's been healing and

reflection and obviously you're in a very different place now

than you were then. If there was a couple pieces of

advice you could give to yourself back, then, what would

they be? You know what really it's be be

kind to yourself sooner. You know and and and really so.

Don't beat yourself up. Exactly.

And and I know it's hard. Yeah it's it's it's natural to

feel guilty and it's natural to feel like a failure.

It's natural but you know because you originally asked

like you know through that process what was one of the

things that you learned and that that is if you can if there's

any way you can try and be you know good to yourself and and

don't forget about yourself you know and and you know my my

partner she's said I can I you know if you're not OK you know

I'm not OK you know like you first have to you have to be in

a good place you have to be happy before anyone else around

you can can be happy or or I don't know if that self love.

No, it does. It's it's the airplane analogy.

I think in many times you know, if you're you're, you're flying

with your child. If the cabin.

Depressurizes whose mask you put on 1st you put yours on. 1st

That's not to be selfish. So if.

That's what you're saying to be more?

Effective. And to be able to exactly.

I think that's a really good analogy actually.

And yeah, and you don't sacrifice.

Yourself for everybody else because there's nothing left and

then and you can't. That's a one time, that's a one

time thing. Just.

Yeah, take it easy on yourself. Be good to yourself and you

know, lean. Don't be afraid to lean on your

friends and family. Honestly, it you have to do it.

Those two things you said are some of the easiest things in

the world, but they're also the things that we either dismiss so

quickly. Like when you say be good to

yourself, there's so many guys that are going through stuff

that don't take what you just said and internalize it.

Like ask yourself the question, am I being good to myself?

What can I do to be good to myself?

But we don't do it and I just think it's really powerful.

It may sound simple or easy, and it is simple, but it's not

necessarily easy because of it's a built.

I think it's a built stigma, yeah, especially for men.

I think it's, you know, you've got to be, you know the the old

thought is you've got to be that provider, you've got to make,

you've got to make everything OK and you, you've got to fix

things. Yeah.

If you can't fix yourself or you can't you know put yourself in a

place where you you know you can be happy.

Yeah, you're you're it's it's a it's a it's a lost cause.

And sorry, my train of thought. No, again.

We Are you kidding me? No, there's no you're you're

that's that's bang on. Like, no, it's.

There was another point I was trying to make with the other

aspects. So you have friends?

With, with reaching out. Yeah, exactly.

Don't. Yeah, you've you've got to

internalize that and don't look weak.

You know and and that that's that's the old old kind of

thought and stigma is that asking for help is you know is a

sign of weakness and which is actually I, in my opinion the

opposite. You know it is.

You're right. It's a sign of strength.

Yeah. Yeah, but it's.

Easy to say, hard to do. But the reason that I think that

it's so cool talking about this with you guys is these are the

messages that keep coming through all of you.

You clearly all kind of believe in this because you are this for

each other, right? You just kind of built it into

what you're doing, absolutely. And the first time that you do

it, it becomes easier and you realize, oh wait a second, this

is a a real piece of truth that has power attached to it.

So just, you know, as through this conversation, I just, I

just want to encourage any guy that's out there that's going

through something. The hardest time to reach out

and ask for help is the first time.

But once you realize it's an actual pathway to moving forward

and and and to getting out of the situation that you're in,

move to that, make that the 1st. Thing that you do.

Don't do it when you have to do it right.

Like, yeah. Seems like a monumental task

and. But you're right.

It, yeah. And the sooner you can do that,

the sooner you can be better to yourself, you know, the more,

more easier the the rest of the process or the process will kind

of work its way through. We heat change that are just

really so excited to have you guys talk a little bit about

what this entire heat change unit movement is about and and

be a part of this. Thank you so much for taking

time to bury your soul a little bit and talk to us about this

it's it's we appreciate it so much.

Yeah. Thank you and and thank you and

and I I'm I'm a huge fan of what you're doing and I and when we

talked earlier on about the concept and you know heat change

I'm I was 100% on board and know what you what you're doing I

hope and I know it will help men out there and and and people so.

Absolutely. Lastly, before we go, what is

proper man to you? Oh my goodness.

Why? Why would you?

See, you said there was going to be no like, off the cuff on your

toes. Yeah, keeping me on my toes.

Oh my goodness What is proper man to me.

My goodness. I I honestly the the I'm trying

to think of something so profound and so witty and

nothing's coming. But the the first word that's

coming to me is brotherhood. Really it is for this as a as a

band, it's it's a it's a brotherhood.

And it's and we've talk to ad nauseam about it today and how

we just rely on one another. How we get to do our passion

together, get to share our struggles, our our triumphs

together, get to make people happy together, you know and we

get to do these kind of cool things together, you know and

and I I think it just, yeah, it's cool to be thought of as as

a as a as a unit and as a as a you know as a proper man concept

because the concept is is is brotherhood, being good to

ourselves. Being good to other people, you

know, your families and so. Hey, guess what?

You didn't think that you said something profound.

That's what the truth is. That's awesome.

And it is a brotherhood. And it's so evident.

Thank you very much for being part of this today.

Appreciate it, Mike. And we'll see you on stage.

Yeah.