Jem Fuller on Empathy, Judgment, and Human Connection

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As always, I am Mike Chisholm, as always, I am excited to be

here to have conversations surrounding the topic of men's

mental Wellness, you know, this this he changed it movement.

That's being built. I'm a broken record.

If you've listened to two or three of these in a row and, you

know, holy cow. Well done.

If you've listened to two or three of these in a row, what

the heck? But I'm going to keep saying the

same thing. If you haven't downloaded the,

he changed it app. What are you waiting for?

It's available of whatever your persuasion and the apple or in

the Google's you can download it wherever you like to to whatever

you like to go to heat change, to.com for more information.

If you like this program, this broadcast, if you think that we

have got some good information here.

Please the heat change it. Overlords love the metrics.

They love when people subscribe. They love when people share.

They love when people. People promote what it is that

we're doing. This is a start up turning into

a movement turning into a force of nature that will change the

world. We are convinced of that we are

hell-bent on that ad, just positive personal development.

Let's let's make the world a better place.

Let's course-correct where it needs to be.

Let's grow, we need to grow and let's take this thing and make

it happen. This is my favorite time of the

week. I do a lot of cool things in my

life that I really enjoy. But there aren't many things

that I like doing more than this.

I love having these conversations, centered around

personal growth, especially in the area of where men are right

now, where we need to be and how we can get there.

And today's guest is a guy who I don't know, man, I call him a

brother from another mother. He's literally on the other side

of the planet. He's in Australia, but through

the Miracles of our wonderful. Wonderful connectivity

technology. We are able To speak together

and and and iron sharpens iron man.

Am I ever sharpened by this guy's name is Gem.

Fuller je M Gem Fuller like I said Australian if you want, as

soon as this podcast is over go over and searched gems.

Ted Talk on conscious communication, unbelievable 10

minutes of inspiration. Opening up the mind as to what

is possible. And also at the same time, that

sounds pretty Whimsical. Also, Common Sense conscious

communication. And anything else that Gemini

get into today are going to be the topics of today's episode of

he cast gem. Thank you for taking time out of

your busy day and helping me figure out the time zone

difference and whatnot so we can make this happen.

I know it's early where you are right now.

Thank you very much for starting your day, being on E, cast,

Mike. What?

A way to start the day. Dude, you have got me fired up

already, seriously. This is, this is the first cab

off the rank for me now, I know today is just going to be

wonderful because of the way it started with you and I love love

your energy, man. This is great.

You know, and it's a gift something that I know that I

have is this infectious energy but it takes fuel to get it

going and, and my rocket fuel energy today is going after

Looking at your Ted Talk, the courses that you're building on

conscious communication, you know, I as we talked about in

the brief time, we talked before we hit the cameras right now,

it's just after the Academy Awards that everyone's talking

about, Will Smith and, and some of these things that are

happening. I'm just thinking about

conscious communication is something that our world, our

entire world needs more than anything, you're dead to.

This isn't funny. There's a funny story behind

that of I've got to share this with you and what was going to

talk about it, but it's just too funny.

So, my publisher. Got my book selected into a

gift. A that got delivered to all the

Oscar nominees a week ago, right.

So my book is sitting in Will Smith's Lounge room and I over

the last week I've been doing a little visualization going.

Now Wills are dude, it'd be great if you read my book.

No and and if you liked it, anyway, hey man, reading my

book. So, a friend of mine rang me

yesterday, and he goes, man, The only thing that could have been

better is if Will Smith went up and slapped Chris Rock with your

book and I anyway, funny funny story making, I'm making a joke

out of something that's not so funny and I know lots of people

are upset about but I do believe that if we can't laugh we're

going to cry and a bit of a bit of humor where we can find it as

a good thing, right? Oh, without a doubt, without a

doubt. And I mean I just I I spoke with

a few people yesterday after watching the backlash of what

was happening. Both sides, you know, are maybe

more than both sides. It's worth three dimensional

here. There's a bunch of sides to what

happened with this, but but I look at this and I go, okay,

there was a group of people who immediately were talking about

toxic masculinity. There is a group of people who

were talking about the idea of Defending one's honor.

A group of people talking about the outrage of making fun of a

biological condition, a medical condition, you know?

And, and there's a lot of people who were yelling and I was

sitting there. Listening, I was listening

listening to what people were saying.

Men talk about a need for conscious.

Communication, did you know, I hold it right there.

You know, in all of this noise, I think the thing that where the

the fine point we're missing is to just ease up on your judgment

of other people for a second. Just take a breath.

Yeah. Right.

You know we're so quick to judge and everyone.

This is humans, right? Human beings with very, very

opinionated. And, and even more than that we

identify with our opinions. Yes.

That we create a sense of identity that is meshed into our

opinions, our ideology, our political standpoint and we

defend our sense of identity above and beyond anything else.

We get, really, really, if we're not physically violent, we get

emotionally or linguistically violent.

To defend our sense of identity and we've identified with an

idea. And, you know, I think there's

so much to be said for us. Practicing to pause and take a

breath and go. How he is, not me, and he's, he

is completely entitled to be him as much as I'm entitled to be me

or her or whoever. And I'm just going to I'm just

going to breathe for a second. Let go of that little that

judgment just a bit. And just, you know, like you

said, listen, man, just listen a little bit.

Yeah, I just it's so interesting to me.

How the world has shifted. I'm 45 at the time of this

broadcast and and I just think about how the world has shifted.

You know, I think about when I was a kid and I would meet

really religious people, you know?

And and, and, and to each their own, no judgment, no anything

right. But I would just see the, the

fervor and how Kevin Smith had a movie.

If a few decades ago called dogma and Chris Rock, who was in

that, movie actually had a line in that movie, that said, you

know, It's okay to have ideas, but beliefs are trickier beliefs

are things. It's trickier to change a belief

than it is to change. An idea, I just wish they had

more ideas and that is where the world.

It seems that people are taking whatever you're talking about

these ideas wrapping up with her their identity as you just

mentioned. Yeah.

And defending it the way that folks defend a religion.

Almost it's almost becoming a fervor and its life.

And death to them. They you know, because when I

write when our ego, our sense of identity is defending itself to

the ego, it is life and death. You know, if you're attacking my

sense of identity to the ego which is an illusion and made up

anyway. It is, it's like life and death

and it's actually not real death.

I've had the death of ego twice in my life and I'm still here,

right? In fact, it was an opportunity

to re-identify. It was an opportunity to have a

look at. You know, how do I want to

identify? What sort of a person do I want

to be how to when someone says hi?

Who are you? What do I want to say to that?

Right. You know, and so the death of

ego as much as our identity is super scared of that.

Yeah, it's okay. You come out the other side,

it's all. Okay.

Right. You talk about the death of ego.

You've had said, it's happened twice in your life.

Your brother. Is that is that one of the

moments or was our related, not to those to Canada and was

living in Canada at the time of my of my day.

Dad getting sick. That's, you know, you would have

heard that in the Ted Talk and yeah, he moved home from Canada

and, and then, you know, very sadly died.

Instantly on his motorbike for months after my dad died.

Not that. That wasn't an ego death.

But it was leading, it was a part of one of the building

blocks, you know, leading up to that.

It was certainly, the most painful horrible experience I've

ever been through to this day. Yeah, but know, that the first

time I had an identity crisis, I was, in my late 20s.

I was living in London. Then and everything that

identified with. So her partner actor,

singer-songwriter, all the things I'd identified with we're

gone. They weren't there anymore.

And I really had forgotten who I thought I was and I'd been

trying to etch out this this personality.

I was a very anti-establishment. I was a punk had been squatting

in abandoned buildings in London and identifying with this.

Can I swear on this podcast? Absolutely.

My cabbages, so identified with this, fuck the system ideology,

right. The last thing I wanted to do

was play into this bullshit system.

I was like, I said, I was anti-establishment.

So I had, you know, dreadlocks and facial piercings and

tattoos. And you know, all this kind of

thing. And I've been trying to create

this hype sense of identity of, who am I, if I'm not, you know,

the average Joe and I lost who I was.

I didn't know who I was, because we identify with our vehicles,

right. Our relationships and our

career, and Things. And all of that was gone.

Yes, I got to the point where I had developed a stutter I was

speaking. So quietly that people couldn't

hear me, you know, if I got on the bus and asked for a bus

ticket, the bus driver would be saying sorry.

What did you say? Because I was speaking.

So quietly, I was so unsure of myself.

I would look in the mirror. Mike and I just would see

nonsensical ugliness, that's where I got to drugs.

Were a part of this self-destructive equation and it

was all looking pretty dire. Yeah.

Anyway, my sister turned up. She was, she was my angel.

She was traveling or working around Europe at the time and

she came and found me in London and she was, hey, brother.

You know, remember you're here to save money to get back to

India. This is back in the days when I

had a love affair, with, with India and Southeast Asia.

She said, remember you were heading there to travel again

and so I kind of remembered what I was doing.

And I got it had enough money to get my ticket to India.

And then spend a year just wandering around India,

Barefoot, and Reinventing, and it ended up becoming Remarkable

year of flow. It was really quite incredible.

I I ran an experiment where I said okay if I don't know who I

am and I've got no desire and what I want to do.

I'm just going to run an experiment.

I'm not going to have any design on the future at all.

Yeah. And and I'm not going to when

someone says hi. Who are you or what are you do?

I'm just going to say nothing. Maybe I'm just here right in

this moment and it was quite an extreme experiment to run but It

ended up being Sublime like the most stunning year of my life.

The flow was incredible. You know, when India is normally

a place where you struggle to get anything done logistically

like you turn up to buy a ticket, it takes you six hours

to buy a ticket. You get to the platform to wait

for the train, you've just missed one.

It takes 4 hours to get on the train, you try and get some

money out of a bank. You got to go to ten Banks and

you know the red tape is thick, right?

And when I was in flow, it was incredible.

Do it was the opposite. I like, I just walk up to the

train station and the platform and the Mine would be just

leaving as I stepped on it. It was just smooth.

And I literally woke up each day and if I felt like it moving,

I'd moved. And if I felt like staying, I'd

stay and that was that. So then I over this time of

contemplation, I traveled on my own for over a year.

And in this time of travelling on my own, there was a lot of

beautiful contemplation. There might have been a little

bit of smoking of but there was a lot of contemplation and A lot

of re-identification you know that so that was the first time

the second time was in my early 40s and that was my midlife

Awakening and that wasn't as scary because I knew I was going

to be okay but it was an opportunity to re-identify.

I did have to lose everything to do that, lost my marriage, lost

my career, lost my house, lost all my belongings, thankfully

kept my two boys, my kids. Yeah, so I had my two boys, I

had one surfboard and one guitar and that was it.

Everything else was gone but that was an opportunity.

To re-identify as well. Anyway, you got me talking down,

okay? This is important, this is

really important as the team and I mean our regular listeners

will have heard me say this a few times but you know it's

worth it's worth talking about again and just like, you know, a

big comic book fan, Stanley always used to say you know

what, every comic is somebody's first comic.

So for the folks who this is their first episode of he cast,

you're hearing me. Say this for the first time, my

wife and her team as they're building, he changed it.

They were looking for all the pain points that That men go

through and and and are going through, you know, the silent

life's of desperation because men don't talk about this shit.

We just don't, you know, we don't take moments normally to

do nothing except exist in the present moment, you know, have a

little bit of pot have a little bit of hash and contemplate,

everything and slow everything down to nothing because we live

in a society where we're told how to connect the dots, what we

need to do. I've used this example so many

times, you know, we get out of school and it's like a get more

educated or get a better job or, you know, with good benefits,

get the wife, the kids, all that stuff and and then suddenly, you

know, guys find 20 years, have gone by, they've connected the

dots and they still don't know what their purpose is.

They still don't know who they are, and you talk about these if

this death of the ego and I think that there's a lot of guys

out there myself included, you know where I'm changing things.

You know, I've got a financial business but suddenly This, this

this thrust of a life purpose of creating a movement that's going

to grow worldwide, and being a broadcaster, and all these

things. And I feel alive.

There wasn't mentioned in the intro.

You know, I feel like I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing

now and it's yeah, raising, but yeah, so many guys that are so

entrenched into the dots that they have created.

They feel like they have created those dots with irreversible

ink. Well, we got sold on a makeup.

Sold on these ideas, didn't we? We got told that if we You know,

if you finish school and you get the best job you can get, and

you earn the money that you can get and then you build the

shelter and that the you're going to be happy.

Yeah, that there's that's meaningful and it's not now.

I mean, it's survival. That's necessary.

Of course, we need shelter food and water.

That's 100%, that's a given, but but once you've got that, if you

don't have any meaning or purpose behind what you're

doing, it can lead to a really unhappy life.

And like you said, man, don't talk about their struggles, you

know, I mean, I've got, I had my deepest darkest, It was a secret

torture for a long time and I was so ashamed to tell anybody,

but I just kept it to myself, man.

And it was, I'm happy to talk about it now because when I talk

about it, men say to me. Oh my God.

Me too. I haven't told anyone about

this, but I developed in my in my marriage that the marriage

that ended. Yeah, I developed sexual anxiety

to the point of not being able to perform.

I would either prematurely ejaculator.

I couldn't have Direction I was impotent or but I would have got

to the point over time. Over years of me, having anxiety

attacks when we'd go to make love right?

And you can imagine how upsetting and disappointing this

is and this wasn't just once or twice man, this was for years.

Yeah and I did not tell anyone and my wife, my poor wife at the

time. She didn't tell anyone either

because we were both so embarrassed about it.

We didn't know how to get out of.

I didn't know how to break free from this psychological Racket,

and it was owing me. And I unto the outside world, I

was successful. I had a corporate job and I had

the house and the white picket fence and and I was yeah, man.

I'm great to my best friend's. I was bullshitting.

Yeah. And deep down inside, I was as

destroyed and as sad as possible, but no one knew, and

there are so many men suffering in their own version of this.

It might not be sexual anxiety. It might be depression or

anxiety, or whatever it is. But there are men that suffer

like this and don't tell anyone because we've been told that we

shouldn't suck it up. Man up.

Don't cry like a girl. Can you believe we got?

Told that is boys, you know, men, still parents.

Still tell their boys. This don't cry like a girl.

That's the most ridiculous thing to say.

Yeah, you know, but we get indoctrinated into this culture.

That doesn't allow for us to be functional.

Yes. We're, you know, you and I

haven't talked about this beforehand and it's beautiful.

Organically it comes up. Our plan is to take back that

phrase man up. We're going to take it back and

we're going to remix it, you know, the idea of Manning up.

Is it can be a positive rallying cry, which is exactly what we

want to do. Talk about conscious

communication, you know, we want Manning up to be.

No, I'm going to talk about what it is that I'm going through and

I'm actually going to deal with what I'm going.

I'm going to man up, I'm going to deal with whatever it is.

You know, I want to before we move on to conscious

communication and moving over to what it is that you have.

You found such a gold. Mine of Knowledge and insight

and you're so poetic in the way that you can talk about it

before we move there. I want to talk a little bit more

about what you went through. Because, I mean, if there are

guys who are sitting there, whatever it might be, you know,

the number one pain Point by the way that that, that the he

changed it. Team realized is kind of the the

the Keystone of what guys are going through is loneliness.

That is number one, and the person that you described the

person that At the reality was not available to the family to

the friends. Is it possible to be lonely?

When you have people around you? Abso-fucking-lutely it is and

can play the right there. Nailed it now.

I mean you can go as deep as you want into the specifics of it or

you can keep it General. But but how did you find your

way out of that situation? Was there a Breaking Point?

Was there a rock bottom similar to when you were in London with

your with your sister or like what?

What facilitated Getting unstuck.

Yeah. Wow.

What was the order of things? It it got to the point after

years of trying to fix it and fix it, right?

And we couldn't, you know, we're caught in and I'm careful.

The only reason I'm careful in my sharing is because there's

another person's story involves a little early and that's her

story to tell. Absolutely.

I'm so I want to I want to be careful about that.

We're not together anymore. We're actually we get along

really well, we co-parent week on week off with our kids.

So we're friends and And we co-parent really well together.

So that's a happy ending to that story.

Got a disclaimer, by the way, for our listeners.

That's a goal if you because I mean how many guys out there

that are listening to, this have gone through a situation like

this? That's a goal.

You want to get to the point where there is, I mean I hate

the buzz words that people kind of make fun of and what not.

But but I when I look at something phrase like conscious

uncoupling, okay if you're going to yeah, yeah.

Conscious about it. Yeah.

The kids sake for the friends for everybody's sake.

That's a good thing. So yeah, it was the hottest one.

Exclaiming, you're actually not even.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So, look for me.

How did I get out of it? That was your question and it's

a really good point. I write about this in the book.

By the way, the first step for me to start healing and it was

healing that I had to do with myself.

The first step was to tell a brother That was the first step

I've been sitting in men's Circle for.

Wow 12 years now and so there's a group of us men.

We sit around a fire. No booze.

No no tobacco no, no pop. We sit around the fire.

We pick a theme. We talked about a meaningful

theme, right? So I'd been sitting around fire

with brothers and not talking about this, right?

And Meanwhile, my brothers are telling that, you know, their

deepest truth around, whatever it, Is that they're going

through as a man, and I was sitting there not sharing my

deepest truth and it felt so inauthentic and it got to the

point where I was like, I have to make a choice here you know.

And one night after the fire, I said to her friend.

Very I alluded to it. I said man, I've got something I

need to say and he said yeah what's up man?

And I said I you know I've got problems with sex.

Because I'll he just kind of brushed it off a little bit.

He had he acknowledged but he said ah me too man you know

sometimes it that works and sometimes it doesn't he kind of

made light of it and I didn't go there any further.

But that was the first step it was to actually language it to

say it to share it to open up to be vulnerable.

Yes, you know, was the first step because it was the most

horrible thing. All I wanted to do for my wife,

not all I wanted but but deep in the core of my sense of being a

man was that I wanted to please As her I wanted to be her man.

I wanted to take her like she'd never been taken before.

You know, I wanted to connect with her sexually to this these

incredible Heights that we can go to work through.

Love making, right? That's what I wanted to do.

I wanted it to be all about her. Yeah, but it because of my

psychological racket, it ended up being everything opposite to

that I became completely self-consumed and self-absorbed

and I couldn't be her man and I couldn't take her and I couldn't

be all the things that I wanted to be and and then The secret

torture of keeping it to myself because I thought I'm the only

one going through this, none of my friends will understand,

right? So the first step was to start

sharing now, you know, I believe that talking and sharing is an

important part of the healing process.

But at the same time Mike I don't believe that that is on

its own going to heal. You need to take responsibility

for your own healing. So then this all led up and then

we had to break up. I said to my wife like we can't.

I'm not going to spend the rest of my life.

Like this, if we can't shift this we've got to, we've got to

get happy, both of us. We need to.

We need to get Happy from when we decided that we were going to

separate it. Took us a year over a year to

even tell the kids. We kept living in the same

house. Wow.

Knowing we were separated and then finally telling the kids

and then finally, moving out etcetera and then the real

healing for me came after a sweat lodge.

You guys know what a sweat lodge is over there.

Right. Absolutely people people.

Know what I'm talking about when I say a sweat lodge.

They're like, what are you talking about, dude?

North American Indian, sweat, lodge.

Absolutely, we had a sweat and I had an out-of-body experience.

And I went back to being I flew and flew and went back to being

five years old which was before my loss of Innocence.

When I was six. My dad God Rest his soul and I

love my dad but my dad lost his temper and beat me up when I was

six and at that, that's when I first started to think, I'm not

good enough. Oh boy.

But prior to that, I was gonna Another was fine.

I was innocent Age of Innocence so I went to five and I had this

out-of-body experience. Then I had a very prophetic

dream and then I realized I woke up the next day and I realized,

oh my god, I've got this deep deep belief that I'm not good

enough, right? And so then I manifested into my

life, I would sabotage, my success, I sabotaged my

marriage. I sabotaged my sexual ability, I

did all of these things to back up the belief that I didn't

deserve happiness, success, abundance, all these things

right? So I was like, wow, I'm going to

change this. I started reading books on the

plasticity of the mind and how we actually change on your

jewelry spends a guy. Yeah man.

Well, that was one of the books I read and I just went to work.

Yeah, I just went to work on myself every single day.

Firing those neurons repetitively over and over and

over and over again. I'm enough just the way I am.

I'm enough just the way am. I said it?

Millions of times and over the course of a year of high

repetition of this changing. My neurology, I started to

believe my own hype and everything changed.

Dude, so that's how there you go.

That's a long answer to your question, but that's how I went

from this dysfunction to, then the healing and then attracting

a woman into my life. We have a stunningly conscious

relationship, it's really quite astounding everyday.

I pinch myself to this relationship and she came into

my life, and she thinks I'm amazing in every way and we

have, you know, the sexual healing occurred, and our

lovemaking is next level do. That's really The beautiful and

tantric and connected, and spiritual, and wonderful, and

yeah, you know, awesome. So, yeah.

Well, and I think about the side effects that have come with the

work that you have done. I don't believe had you not gone

through this experience and process.

I mean, let me, let me throw it out there.

Would you even know what conscious communication is if

you come in through that? I mean, no, no, it's completely

things. I completely and I wouldn't be

the Coach that I am, you know, and I wouldn't be the speaker

that I am, and at the author and all the things that I'm doing

now because I'm like, you man. I'm so on a mission, you know,

and this Mission drives me every day and I wouldn't have the, I

wouldn't be me to be able to do what I'm doing now if I hadn't

gone through everything I've gone through, so absolutely no

regrets and anything I can do to help anyone who's stuck, you

know, in struggle if they want it.

I'm certainly not an evangelist, I ain't go and I'm not telling

anyone what to If I don't want to know but if someone says to

me hey Jim, I'm really curious I'll talk for hours about it and

I'm grateful for that. You're already helping people

who are hearing this right now. I'm I'm super excited that that

our paths have connected because I don't believe it's going to be

the last time. You know, I want to move to the

to the communication side of things because it is it is the

idea of conscious communication, the art of conscious

communication, that's the name of the book and and program,

you've got a master mind group or a master class to help do

this with leaders that is coming out a lot of exciting things.

The the Ted Talk, all the things that you do around this idea.

Let's, let's go right to base camp.

What is conscious communication to you?

In? Its most simple form being more

conscious of something is being more aware of it.

So the moral conscious, we are of anything, the more aware we

are of it and and communication really is Underpins our ability

as a species to do anything right?

Whether it's taken idea and manifested into reality

Einstein's. Brilliant understandings of the

mechanics of the universe would have meant nothing, if he

couldn't communicate them, right?

Wouldn't have meant anything, you know?

So to take an idea and manifest it into reality, it hundred

percent needs communication for us to solve problems.

You know, it we've got to do this through our ability to

communicate and and you know, Having coached thousands and

thousands of hours over the last 15 years for me the most common

sticking point or the most common place, where we trip

over, whether it's in a relationship between two people

or whether it's in the relationship between a leader

and a team or whether it's into departmentally within an

organization. We trip over in

miscommunication. Yes, you know, and watch for

that. Why do why do we do that?

Is it awareness? Yeah.

Look, I think the reason for it is because we are so completely

and under what you unaware. We're not even aware of this,

but we're so completely caught up and driven by our ego, our

sense of identity. Yeah, yeah, necessarily we have

to have an ego. It's not a bad thing.

It's a part of being human and arguably it evolved with us as a

species to to protect us and keep us here, right?

So we need to have a sense of identity, I get that, but when

we are unaware of our sense of identity, which is Erica when we

are unaware of it. It's driving the bus, right?

It's reacting, it's queuing up. You know, someone saying

something. And if you disagree your you

can't wait to and you might even speak over the top of someone to

prove them wrong and prove yourself, right?

That's all ego. You know this the watching

people shouting at each other. Now you know like even with this

incident with the you know the Will Smith Chris Rock incident.

Yep, which is what it is. But you and I were talking about

this before, it's just fascinating.

That people are just Shadows. And each other, and this is

what's right? And this is what's right and

this it's like, wow, that's all. There you go.

That's all identity. That's all my way or the

highway. Yeah.

And that's, you know, and quite often.

That's where we come unstuck, you know, and so I think being

conscious in communication being more aware of the communication

itself. So communication is about as

coming together. It's about creating a common

understanding of something. Doesn't mean you have to agree,

but it means that we can come to a common understanding.

Yeah, right. Location is a sharing.

So if we're aware of the communication itself, if we're

serving the greater good of the communication, then it means

that we're putting ourselves a little bit to the side and and

serving what's good for the greater good.

So we're here now and I'm listening to you say, and you've

got something that you want me to understand.

It's going to serve for me to put my own opinion to the side

for a little bit and really seek to understand You know?

Yeah, I think about what you're saying and I think about how

when Life Starts going, and the plates are spinning and we're

moving from one thing to the other to the other and how easy

it is to slip away from what you're from.

From from the idea of that awareness of taking a second of

taking that moment to Just Breathe to let something sink in

to our Even through a pandemic. It's funny, you know, at the

beginning of the pandemic, I found that that there was a lot

of that. There was a lot of old slowing

down. This is what the world needs.

I remember hearing that but but it's funny how it almost moved

that even though we weren't busy outside of our houses, depending

on the region that we're from. But we still were we still got

to that place where all those plates are spending and that's

all we were focused on and the lack of awareness.

Like what? What will it take for a shift to

happen? Is it one person at a time?

You know, kind of, kind of being a beacon of light.

When it comes to these things, is there a is there a, an

experience that can happen, you know, corporately or with all of

us as a group? What are some ways that we can?

We can help be agents for change for this.

Yeah. By having conversations like

this. Yeah.

Super, super important more important than you would even

pay credit to people might think, are you just having a

conversation? It's Station to the change that

create change in a functional way.

It's either conversate, it's either good solid conversations

or violence one of the other and I'm a pacifist.

So the I'm not going to do the violence thing, right?

I'm a pizza - yeah, good conversations but in terms of on

a macro level, what creates change, pain, pain creates

change, you know, and the pain of a pandemic, a global

pandemic, and, you know, as much as mainstream media and news has

us focus on all the negatives and A thing that's going wrong

and how terrible the world is because that's what sells right

and I haven't watched or consumed mainstream news for

more than 20 years and I'm still here and I still know what's

going on but mainstream news will have us focus on that and

have us believe. The world is a terrible place.

It's actually not and do. There are lots of positive

people like you and your partner doing this good work and the

more we connect and have conversations, the more that we

kind of draw the lines between these good solid movements and

Is change afoot, there are people creating change, you

know, I work most of my bread-and-butter work is

coaching leaders in government departments, and in

organizations, and in businesses change is happening.

You know, people are hungry for it.

People want it, you know? So it's we're just got to keep

on. Right?

Keep on and as an individual. What can you do?

Work on yourself? Yeah.

Meditate, yes. Teach yourself to pause.

Teach yourself to let go of your reactionary.

Opinion on things, you know, when you're scrolling through

social media and you see someone say something and you have a

reaction to that. Notice that reaction just put

the phone down for a second. Stop scrolling.

And just sit and notice your mind racing to defend this idea

that you have about the way you think things should.

But just notice it go, huh. That's interesting.

Isn't it that I'm so vehement. Lee opinionated already?

Yes. Teach yourself to pause.

I I don't know. Are you a Power of Now by

Eckhart Tolle? Yeah.

Yeah, completely. And 100%, you know, that I

reminded of that immediately reminded of two things.

As you're as you're talking about this the activation and

then, of course, solving of that activation and and I love the

idea that our brain just think about your hand, right?

Your hand is part of you but if you chop your hand off, you're

still here, right? Yeah.

And, and how he kind of marries the idea that your brain is

something very similar to that and and you can separate your

Yourself out and kind of get curious about your brain and

your thinking patterns, you know, the idea of of the getting

activated, holy shit, somebody just said something about Will

Smith was it was it was a good one.

You know, what happened to me yesterday somebody said what a

display of toxic masculinity and blah blah blah blah blah blah

blah blah. Like they just they just fucking

railed against him. And the yeah, it's like they put

in a little box and said, okay, we're done.

Now you're right and and I'm like, oh okay.

So That's the conversation, is it?

And then, and I was sitting there going, okay, and I did

exactly that. I moved myself out and I started

analyzing it and it's like, one of the things that I came up

with is I'm afraid to respond, which is.

Yeah. And and that's actually what.

I ended up telling her I actually said to her, I'm afraid

like I didn't take it on, it was off social media.

We went to direct message I said and she's someone that I know

and trust and respect a great deal.

Yeah, sure. I said, you know, I am afraid.

I'm actually scared to return than anything that disagrees

with anything that you're saying here.

Yeah. And we talked about, we unpacked

it and we went down this path and I was analyzing that fear.

I was curious about that we can play with this and we can get

curious about about about stuff when we and again, it's a

different type of awareness, but we just got to be.

We just gotta wake up. We got to be like a little

groundhog that pops his head out.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. That you're right.

Exactly. Yeah, it's so true and then it's

a practice, right? You don't kind of out.

The groundhog doesn't just kind of Pop his head up once and go,

oh, there's the big wide world and then go back down again and

forget, you know, we need we need to create habitual

perspectives and habitual practices that help us do this

because you know, we slip into eyes closed organically and

naturally. It's what we do we go into we go

into you know operational mode and the subconscious is Being

most of what we do and that's fine.

That's okay, that's functional. You know, I'm walking to the

car, I'm not conscious of every single thing, every single time

I'm moving through everything that single moment.

That's not the point. You know, I think being

unconscious is functional as well.

We're going to cruise around and get shit done, right?

Yes, I just think that there's a lot of opportunity, a lot of

space for us to teach ourselves to be more present, more

conscious, more aware, more often, you know, and it's super

functional. Communication.

That's what I'm talking about in the book and there are

practices. You know, I meditate every every

morning it's become habitual for me, I've integrated mindfulness

into my day-to-day, you know, there's a habit, stacking James

Clear in that book or Atomic habits talks about it very

simply. You want to create a new habit,

link it to an existing habit. So for example, brushing your

teeth put a sticky note next to your toothbrush on the mirror in

the bathroom that says pause or mindful mindfully, right?

Right. And then what happens is that,

every time you pick up your toothbrush, you're creating a

neural Association to take a pause and be mindful.

Now, I don't have a sticky note next to my toothbrush.

Every time I pick up my toothbrush, I go into a

mindfulness, integrated mindfulness practice, right?

It's the same with my coffee machine.

I had one next to my coffee machine.

Every time, I open my beans to go and dried my beans and make

my coffee, which is a little ritual.

I love in the morning. Every time I do that, now, I

don't have the sticky note but every time that lid comes off

those beans, Pause and continue, right?

So we can start to create habitual practices.

That incentivize us, being more aware more conscious more often

absolutely are. Okay?

So I want to talk about two little things there.

The first one is, I want to reinforce what you just said.

Now number one, it's very easy, it just picked for things that

you do constantly, you know, put a little sticky note there, but

let's take it for a second and say, what are we reminding

ourselves to do? Uh-huh.

And the reality is what I just did there is actually the better

part. Yeah, it's great that we can

take our habits and do that. But just how easy is it to take

a second to take two or three deep breaths?

The Habit, stacking is amazing. And for our male logical Minds,

you know that like to compare compartmentalize and all that

stuff, that's a great way of learning how to do it.

But but what are we teaching ourselves how to do its Just

taking a pause. Yeah, yeah.

Talk about the power of the pause.

That's a thing right there. So it is just get into that

place and it's so fucking easy. It's yeah, it is.

It is one of these deceptively simple.

Yeah. How awful powerful habits to

create the pause moment. I'm so glad you brought it up,

dude. I, it's I bang on about the

pause moment. I first heard about this in

2014, I was at the Will mindful leader forum.

And there were awesome leaders from the World Bank and from

Wall Street, and from politics politicians, you know, really

successful leaders in the whole Forum was about mindfulness and

the power of mindfulness. And this keynote speaker got up

on the stage. He was a, he was quite short of

stature unassuming quite humble, but he just emanated this

beautiful wise energy, right? And he walked up onto the stage

and the whole Auditorium just You could hear a pin drop and he

was projected up on this big massive screen behind him and he

came up on the stage and it was just the right timing.

You know, you hear these wise words, but if it's not the right

time and you go, oh yeah, that's kind of wise.

But you don't do anything with it and then sometimes it's just

the right timing to hear something.

And this guy got up on stage and there were two things that he

said that really stuck with me. One of them was he said, no the

work. He was talking about meditation.

He said no the work but then he said do the work and that stuck

with me because Is at the time. I just started my coaching

practice and I was prescribing meditation to my clients but I

wasn't doing it regularly. I was doing it a bit here and

there and that's when I went I'll shit, man, I've to have

authenticity. I've got to do the work but the

second thing he said was pause often.

Well, he said, pause often, and I went, wow, what does that

mean? And I took that and I created

what I call pause moments and so I'll pause moment is very simply

stop what you're doing. Pause take a breath and just

notice what you can notice in that moment from just notice,

notice your heart rate, notice your breathing, notice?

Any Sensations, just what can you notice?

And then continue. Now this only takes three to

five seconds. So, it's not, like, I've got a

dedicated, an extra half an hour to meditating, and I don't have

time to do that. My life to B know, it's three to

five seconds, right? And so I find really helpful

times to pause is in between tasks.

So, I've just finished an email. I'm about to go and put the

kettle on pause. When I'm physically going

somewhere and walking to the car halfway to the car stop.

Pause, especially when I'm running late.

I'd personally don't like being late.

It's a value of mine. I Don't mind if you're late to a

meeting with me but I don't like being late to the meeting.

Yep, so if I'm running late and I'm racing these days, I'm

running late to a zoom meeting, right?

So, I'm running late. I'm just about to open my

laptop, pause take a breath. I can the laptop now, I'm only

three seconds later than I would have been otherwise, but I'm

showing up in a different state and these pores moments as you

become, as they become familiar for you, there are little micro

recalibration back to your place of equanimity, back to your calm

centeredness, like that. And you can go from being

flustered to calm, you can go from being disappointed or

frustrated or angry even up to come.

Like that, this is this is a superpower, dude.

You're the driver of your own physiological bus now, right?

You're not a victim to how you've reacted to something that

someone said and now you're pissed off and now it's going to

be one of those days and when it rains it, pours and the whole

thing goes. So no, no, no, no, you're not a

victim to that anymore. You're like, no, no.

I have something to say about my physiological state of being in

this moment, which then dictates the quality of what I'm doing,

which then, dictates my results, right?

So, I think it's Very understated man to come back to

it. Pause moments is massive.

Yeah it's a it's taking time to stop and and realize that you

are driving and and as opposed to, you know, there's there's

when you're present driving and you're just autonomic Lee

driving, you know, those are two very different things.

Yeah. I think about, you know, the

Aaron that I ran this morning that it was, I was rushed for

and all that and I can't think of, you know anything Any

details on that trip? Who cross the street in front of

me, or whatever. But when I'm actually present

and driving, I can remember the entire thing and those are two

completely different states of mind.

You, you know, this is, it's not just about literally driving,

it's about, you take a pause and then you realize, oh, okay, you

are driving. And, and you can handle when

your spouse is coming down on you and maybe they're activated

in your whatever you can handle that.

You are driving. You don't have to up the T?

Yeah, work any of this stuff. You can you can you can let that

frustration all just melt away. Yeah, whatever.

Frustration it is. You can add and pausing like you

say, it's a superpower. Yeah.

And it is, I think pausing is an essential step in a process.

To remember that your ego was driving and your ego is

defensive and your ego is justifying Its Behavior and

judging and trying to, you know, Reaffirm its sense of who it

thinks it is but and its ideas and it's ways and my way kind of

thing. So creating the habit of pausing

gives you a moment to go. He go look at you go, you

desperate. You're desperate right now, but

we're safe. There's no lion coming to eat

us. We're not actually in danger

right now. Yes, your your wife just asked

you why? You haven't cleaned the kitchen?

That's all. Yeah, and you were there going.

Yeah well and, you know, I have to get to it.

And I'm not sure why I didn't clean the kitchen and my ego is

defending like it's life and death and it's like if you can

just create that moment when your when your wife has said, oh

hey honey I'm why haven't you cleaned the kitchen if you can

just create that moment ago. Pause and Listen to Your Ego

going. Tell her why blah blah blah and

just go he go look at you go brother.

We're safe. No lion coming to eat us right

now. Just take a breath notice and

now talk about why you haven't done the kitchen yet but you

just don't need that edge of defensiveness, you know?

Yeah, I am grateful. How much and I mean, we didn't

talk about this beforehand intentionally because if we

would have, we would have been able to replicate it, and I had

talked about that at the moment. Got on here it was like a very

known pre-interview so I didn't know you're going to talk about

the ego today and I'm glad you did because I think that the ego

gets a bad rap. I think that the ego is

misunderstood by a lot of people.

I think there are some people who think that the goal should

be to kill the ego. Yeah.

To get rid of it locked. That's not it.

That's not bad, right? Yeah.

Good lucky. You try and kill the ego you.

Good luck. You take the ego will take the

gloves. He's off and then you're really

going to have a disturbing in a dialogue, going on between you

and your ego which is all a part of you anyway.

Right, right look II. My my way of of creating some

functionality around identity and ego.

There's a few different things that I do, but one of them is

that when I have a conversation in my head with my ego which

might sound crazy but it's it's it just is what it is.

I go there with love I go they would love, you know, when I

noticed my ego because our ego wants to Justify wants to judge

its desperate to be right. You know that that part of you

that goes I told you so you said it was on the 15th of November.

I told you was on the 13th right that need to go right.

Yep. You know, it hates looking

stupid, really hates it. All of these things is ego

things. When I notice my ego driving, I

just call it out with love. He got look at you go.

Bless your cotton socks. Trying to keep us safe.

Shit, out of me like you're playing a lion.

Yeah. Right.

Exactly. Like you're petting a lion?

Yeah, calming it down. Hey, I'm glad I'm glad you're

part of me and I know you've got my best interests at heart.

It's okay. But, and you can carry on even

if you want ego as a voice, in my head, justifying our Behavior

carry on. I'm not even going to try and

stop you but I've got your number, mmm, right.

I'm just shining a light on it and it dissipates.

It goes row, row row, row, row row row.

Oh, that did it, did it. And then I can pause Then I can

respond rather than react, right?

So this is one of those things with the ego is just to have

some awareness around it. I hate that that this goes so

quickly I love that. It goes so quickly because it

means we're in the flow and the street.

Yeah well that I before we before we sign off we got to

talk a little bit about your Ted talk.

I'm fascinated by it, you know, obviously you take articulate.

I think that I'm articulate sometimes and then I watched

your Ted Talk and it's like I got a long way to To go.

It was literally, I watched your Ted Talk and we're talking ten

minutes, folks, gem, Fuller, Ted Talk.

That's all you got to Google. You will find him.

And and you will have ten minutes that are extremely worth

much more than the time that they take to you.

I want to talk about that because you articulated, I can

only imagine the preparation that must have been done for

that because it was every bit, as I use the word info task.

When somebody can actually teach me something and do it in a way

that compels me, I love it. You were info tastic, but you

were also poetic the vocabulary, the alliteration and the

delivery of all of those things in one were phenomenal.

How long did it take you to prep that talk?

And how special was that taught compared to a coaching session?

That that you do? I mean, was it was it weeks of

Rehearsal, like you were rehearsing, you know, the

barters as, you know, Shake Ya Yin experience.

I yeah, I rush it as a spoken word.

So I wrote it as a performance piece.

I've been, I've been writing poetry and songs since I was 15

and I met 50. So, I love the expression

through word and song. So I wrote it as a performance

piece, as a spoken word, and then I learnt it verbatim.

And it that took me maybe a month before shooting it of just

reading it over. And over and over, and over, and

over and over again. And the timing is important to

me, you know, I did study Shakespeare when I was at drama

school and pentameter is important.

Timing is important, pauses are important.

So it was all very intentional and and then I hope that it

didn't come across to intentional as well.

I mean, it is what it is. It's there, right?

But we shot it in lockdown and where I, where I am in

Australia, like some of the regions in Canada, we've Had the

longest lockdown periods globally.

I mean in Victoria Australia. We were locked down for most of

two years, so I couldn't have an audience but it was an

opportunity that my book publisher had presented for me

to do a tedx talk. And I'm like, wow, that's that's

a big opportunity and I noticed some people doing their tedx

talks in lockdown and they would just get a webcam in their

office and do a green screen, Ted sign and that's what they

did. I didn't want to do that.

I thought this might be the only chance To do a tedx talk.

So I'm going to invest I went and had that sign made

professionally. I hired a theater.

I've got hired a film crew. I did it as best I could I

rehearsed it. I learnt it.

I performed it. So I made it means the world to

me that you really appreciate it because I invested a lot of time

energy and money into it. So I'm really glad that you

appreciate it. And obviously, I'm passionate

about the messages in there. And, you know, I'm a father of

teenage boys. My older boy just turned 18 last

week and my other The boy will be turning 16 soon.

And I'm watching these young boys become men and and I

believe it as men and parents and women all of us we have a

big responsibility to do what we can to help create a better

generation, you know? This is evolution right?

We should be looking to how we can improve, you know, and I'm a

massive, massive Champion, massive champion of anybody who

is fighting the fight to have more women in decision-making

roles because We need that globally.

We need more women in decision-making roles, but with

that, there's no point in putting women into

decision-making roles. If the only way they can succeed

in those roles is to switch on their masculine and play this

masculine game. We need to change the game, we

need to change the game so there needs to be two things going on.

We need to be empowering and creating opportunities for women

to have an equal share of running a world.

We don't need it, but accessing their feminine wisdom, their

feminine feminine intuition, their feminine power and Men.

We need to show men that they've got access to feminine energy as

well. Feminine intuition, feminine

human-centric nurse but this, this kind of more Global

nurturing caring. Can we just look after each

other, while we do this? Why do we have to be horrible to

each other? To be successful?

We don't, that's an old idea. We don't.

We can actually be successful being considerate and kind to

each other at the same time. Imagine that right.

Wow, dude. Okay, I swear to God everybody

we didn't talk about this beforehand in any way, shape, or

form. I'm going to talk about, he

changed it right now, a little bit because we get this, my wife

is building. I mean, don't get me wrong.

She's got a team of people who are mostly men but there's a lot

of women who are involved in and he changed it.

My wife is the founder of he changed it and and she gets it.

Why the fuck is a woman building a men's mental health, men's

mental, Wellness app and, and she answers it the same way

because He's a fucking Pro and and it's, it's old thinking that

says that, and she kills it with kindness and love, but strength

as well, I'm a mother and I don't enjoy the world that my

boys are inheriting. Yeah.

And and, and talk about that. Feminine energy.

Talk about father and mother right now.

Men need a mother. Yeah.

And and you look at me to and cancel culture and all these

things and and shame and and the lack of vulnerability.

The I'm talking about it. All of those things.

This entire platform is based from a mother who doesn't like

the world, her boys are inheriting and, and, and, and we

she's even not accepted investment money.

We're still bootstrap in this thing.

It's a start that's being run out of our house because she

won't even accept investment money from people who don't have

the vision of the mission Paramount.

Yes, Prophet will come all these things will come big.

Things will come from. It's a tech company of course

they will. Yeah, nothing.

When it comes to that side of the business will supersede the

mission of creating a world that she can be okay to rest her

final rest that her boys are going to be all right?

And and you saying that oh my God.

It just I cannot wait to have candy.

Watch this conversation that we do today because that needs to

be a message that more people need to talk about and and yeah

I I can't believe you just said that we need to win it to work

together, we need to work together as humans.

Yes. Right to improve this situation.

This division thing doesn't work, you know, and it's

interesting that your wife is setting this up.

You know, I ran a woman's retreat in Bali and Indonesia

for seven years before covid came and shut that down and I

will run it again. And I was a man facilitating and

holding space. Awesome women to come on Retreat

and it just wasn't even an issue for me.

I didn't even think about it. Someone had this Idea.

And I just went. Yeah, that's a great idea.

I'll go do it. You know, a female client of

mine said, could you run your Himalaya Retreat, instead of

running it in the mountains? Could you run it in a five-star

Resort in Bali? And I went?

Yeah, sure. So, I just started doing that,

and it was a non-issue, but it was beautiful.

And these all of the clients that have come over the years on

this Retreat would come up to me and say, thank you.

You held space so beautifully for us to be vulnerable, and

powerful and, and, and to access our inner wisdom and and

Sensibility Our intuition and how we want to lead.

Yes, so and so, yeah, absolutely.

It makes complete sense to me that your wife is driving this

mission to make the world a better place for men.

Yeah, well and I mean and there's you know, there's stuff

coming down the pipe to I mean she's also a smart business lady

to she's got. You know, she changed.

It is sitting there we changed. It is sitting there thinking to

the sitting there and then but yeah the dire situation and it

is dire you know, World Health. Calls.

Mental Wellness is silent crisis it dude greet.

You know, suicides are middle-aged men.

Yeah. Yeah.

And and 90 something percent of the world's violence is from

men. Yes.

Because they're not. Then, you know, if you, if you

are operating beautifully internally, if you are healthy,

if you are happy, if your sense of well-being is good, you're

not violent. We only are we only we only act

out violently when we're not happy about something.

Only hurt people hurt. We need to help heal the hurt.

You know what I mean? And so look I'm so glad you guys

are they're doing this thing man.

You've got a champion over here in Australia.

I'm going to be singing your praises and spreading the word

as much as I can about. You guys are Jim, I appreciate

that. And again, I've had so many

guests on this podcast where I just note them and know what it

is that they're doing that when this thing blows up the

Partnerships that will happen as soon as soon as some of the

knuckleball stuff gets out of the gets out of the way, the The

ships that will happen and that will supercharge other folks is

message. Yours is one of those you are

one of those people gem like I am so grateful that that we had

this conversation in are talking about this today, for folks,

who, appreciate where you're coming from, they like your

Vibe. What's the best way for somebody

to follow you other than, you know, obviously, you can go to

Jim Fuller.com, you can check out, you know, there's all of

the resources that you have the Horses, things like that.

The Ted Talk is there. If somebody wants to interact

with, you wants to do one-on-one coaching sessions with you

things like that. What's the best way to get you

just day and met through any of those platforms?

I'm Jim Fuller everywhere. So Jim Fuller on Insta and

Linkedin, and Facebook and blah, blah, blah.

I don't do Twitter, I whatever it don't try and talk to me

through to through Twitter. Email, me gem at Jim Fuller.com.

Good old-fashioned email. You can DME through in stir or

Facebook and I'll get. It is just gem Fuller, but

Please reach out. Like you said, Mike we're

putting together a mastermind course for leaders and

communication. And that's going to be really,

really awesome. I love working with leaders

because leaders have a ripple effect.

So if we help a leader bit more conscious and better as a

leader, then the positive ripple effect goes, goes beautifully.

So reach out to me, Janet Jim Fuller.com.

Shoot me, an e-mail, or DME through Instagram, and and we'll

get in touch. I'm still very accessible and I

pride myself on being able to get back to people.

So you will get a message back from me.

And all my business manager but it'll probably be me.

She'll forward it, to me and say, hey, gem.

This person's trying to get in touch with you and I'll reach

out. So let's let's start it.

And I believe to Mike that it is through connection and it is

through collaboration that we create multiplying situations.

So one plus one equals way more than two and and, and together

if we keep doing this, we can actually create positive.

Are you still there, buddy? You Frozen on my end.

Oh my gosh, right at the very end.

Buddy, are you there? Oh man.

Okay, well, we're still recording on our end.

So what I'm going to do is I'm going to finish up with that

sentence right there. And say, okay, I couldn't agree

more, we can definitely, definitely create positive

change. We can do it on a worldwide

scale and I can't tell you how grateful I am to have, had you

here gem gem at Jim Fuller.com. I'm so grateful for this podcast

today and everything that that gem is doing in the World.

I'm just this is why we do what we do.

Oh, there, are you back Jim? I'm back, man.

Okay, I don't know what happened.

I think it was my end was it? I okay.

No no. That's we can we can edit right?

Oh yeah we can we can we can totally edit this and what and

we will but at the end of the day, I could not agree more with

what you're saying, multiplication that can happen,

we can change the world and and anybody who tells us that we We

can't change the whole fucking world and be a beacon for light.

They aren't thinking big enough and they also aren't taking into

consideration. That there are many, many

factors that have changed the world in the past.

Why can't it be this Force for good, right?

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Matt just quickly, yeah, I know

that we're running out of time, but another great book that I've

just read. Is Johann Hari.

He's book, stolen Focus, highly recommend this book.

He talks about change and that sometimes change seems

Insurmountable right? So for example Led Led was being

used in our pencils and in our petrol and in our fuel and in

our gasoline and and Lead was everywhere and it was terrible

for us again killing us you know, it was one woman in the UK

one woman in the 80s, who started spearheading this

campaign for us to take LED out of our paint and for us to take,

let out of our pencils and our petrol.

This one woman shouted. So loudly and created a movement

and she created change, we don't put lead in Our paint anymore, I

petrol, right? Yeah.

It's the same with the, with the women's movement before a

handful of women stood up and went.

No. Right?

It was it was and still is to a large degree, but it's things

are getting better, but it was very recently.

Yes, a male-dominated world completely male, dominated

everything in every structure was male-dominated, right?

So it would have been very easy for people to go are we can't

change that, right? But a handful of women went,

we're going to give it a RedHot crack and that's what creates

the change, right? So this idea now, that what

you're saying are, we can't make the world a better place.

It's bullshit. We actually can.

So, stand up, get up. Share this podcast, talk about

it, read the book, get involved, you know, the more of us that

get involved and create a Groundswell, we will make the

change. There is no better place to end

this. Then there, I'm sad that we're

ending it right now, but it's like, the Cowboys say they don't

say goodbye to. Each other, they say, see you

later, that's what you. And I are going to do, we are

brothers from another mother. Jim, I cannot thank you enough

for, for starting your day with us today and I can't wait to see

what the future holds for all of us.

Thank you so much for being on. He casted a buddy.

Yeah, thanks for having me, Mark, your you're a legend and

I'm really glad I met you, my man.

I right back at you. They go quick.

Every single time we do, one of these things, they go.

So fucking quick, but I'm very grateful for it.

I'm grateful for everybody. Has reached out and talked about

how this has been such a positive experience for them and

they're changing their lives and it just encourages us to no end

you know we're taking things and we're building them and soon

there's going to be the magnifying glass, the megaphone

whatever whatever analogy you want to use on what he changed

his building and it is going to be once again please.

So the he change it. Overlords don't get too mad at

me. Please subscribe, please share

and if you haven't downloaded the app, what the heck?

Are you waiting for Jump On In? That is another episode of he

cast the official podcast of he changed it.

My name is Mike Chisholm go change.

Something